People Over Performance | Bethany Beal an Enneagram Type 3

High achievers and the message your heart longs to hear.

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The Enneagram can name your patterns. It can't set you free from them. That's the difference between insight and transformation, and it's the whole focus of this summit.

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https://www.simplywholehearted.com/wholehearted-2026

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SPEAKER_00 1:39

Hi friends, welcome back to the Simply Wholehearted podcast. It means so much to have you choose to take this conversation along with you today. I'm Amy Wicks, your host, and here at Simply Wholehearted, we provide perspective, purpose, and plans to help you love God, love others, and live your best life. We are traveling through our summer in the Aneagram, and now we're stopping to visit and learn a little bit more about the type 3s, as well as the message each type longs to hear. You may have figured out by now that we value the insights of the Anneagram, and I believe that this resource will guide you to create your best plan for a wholehearted life. But this can't happen until you understand who we're created to be and the message your heart longs to hear. Especially for those trying to still determine their dominant type. You'll want to tune into each episode to see what you might resonate with most. And for those of you who are confident of your type, you'll want to tune in to each episode because we have something for each type every week. Not to mention it may help you better understand the other types in your life. Before we dive into this conversation with Bethany Beale, here are some details and telltale signs about the Aneagram Type 3. They are competent and often pride themselves on efficiency. They enjoy being able to motivate the people around them, and they are often able to recover quickly from setbacks and take on the next challenge. The type 3s, like the type 2, are part of the heart trial. But unlike the type 2, they are in the assertive stance and they also excel in being focused on the future. Here are some great tips to help you get along with the 3. Tell them you like being around them, even when they aren't accomplishing something. But let them know when you are proud of their accomplishments. Give them honest yet kind feedback. And don't be surprised when at times they prefer to finish their project over spending time with others. Now, as an Anya Agram type 3, I did have a hard time not sharing all the negatives as well. But for this summer series, I thought it would be way more fun to focus on all the great traits each type has to offer the world. Bethany Beal, who's today's guest, has been on the Simply Whole Hearted podcast before. You may remember our conversation with her and her sister on Valentine's Day. They are the dynamic duo of Girl Define and are tackling the tough topics women of all ages are wanting to talk about. Their newsbook, Sex, Purity, and the Longings of a Girl's Heart, is taking this conversation to another level. It is a deep dive into the mindsets we all have toward intimacy. Single or married, this conversation is gold. Plus, we're talking about the longings of each heart. The message we long to hear in your dream style. Well, Bethany, catch us up. We've been married for what, six, seven months? How's the married life going?

SPEAKER_01 4:40

Yes, it's been just over seven months and it's been wonderful, super, super amazing. Um, it's it's been kind of crazy because it's like, oh, you know, life can change so quickly, you know. Like a year ago, two years ago, it was like I was not, you know, I had known Dave, my husband. We were really good friends, but never really thought anything would come of it, you know, because it's like I'm going on 30, single, you just kind of expect maybe this, it's nothing will ever really happen. Yeah. So when it actually started to happen, it was it was kind of like a shock to me and my family. I know my wedding, my dad was like, I never thought you'd actually get married. I'm like, but in a good way. So he was really sad though. Like, you know, he loved having me around. But marriage is wonderful and Dave's wonderful, and we're just still very much in the beginning days of figuring it all out and learning how to communicate and oh my goodness, everything like that.

SPEAKER_00 5:32

Everything. Okay, so you are an Annie Graham three. What type is Dave?

SPEAKER_01 5:38

So Dave is a one.

SPEAKER_00 5:40

Oh man. And so seriously, it's a great combination. I have to have to tell you that.

SPEAKER_01 5:46

It's really oh, you're so you're so sweet. Yeah, we're figuring, we're definitely figuring it all out. I am a you know, very kind of bold and go getter type of girl. And, you know, after being single for so long, I'm still trying to adjust to like, okay, wait, we're in this together. We both have good personality traits, and your personality is good, and we can work together to make an amazing team. So we're still we're still figuring all that out.

SPEAKER_00 6:11

Absolutely. Yeah, because there's that you've been independent for so long, and so has he. So there's a merging of lives, and I think a three in particular is fairly strong and independent, and you know, it's a little bit different when you're conforming and you know, learning and growing on being on the compromises and being a little bit more fun.

SPEAKER_01 6:33

Oh, yeah, exactly. And I would say he's probably better at that than me, you know. I kind of see everything a little bit through, I just kind of see life through a little bit more of a black and white lens, and he sees it a little bit more through a gray lens. So that's been a big adjustment. Just even talking about things. I'm like, how no, that's not right, you know. And he's like, maybe view it a little bit differently. So I think I've become much more gracious since marrying him and still need to become more of that. But he, I think his one and my three, we complement each other really well in different ways. And it I feel like if we're intentional, we can, you know, learn and grow and pull out, I guess, the better sides of it.

SPEAKER_00 7:12

Absolutely ourselves. Oh, it's so good because they they really do um work well as a team, those numbers. Uh threes are part of the assertive stance, which are very forward-thinking. And so you're always thinking about the future and you're moving on in the next thing. And we're the one is part of the compliance stance, which is very present-oriented. And oh man, I know as a fellow three, you know, I feel your pain on the whole, you know, we're it's great we can thank future, but we also need those people to help us, you know, kind of dial into the present a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 7:49

Yeah, you know. Oh, exactly. Yeah. And he's that's one of the things is like, you know, when someone's going through something difficult or even um just relating to people, I'm a little bit more of like a problem solver, like, okay, how can we fix this for the future? Yeah. And he's much more like dives in the moment with them, like, wow, I'm so sorry to hear that. Or, you know, were you just even encouraging, like, wow, you're amazing, you know? And I'm kind of always a few steps ahead. So it's kind of like slowing down and really entering in those moments. It's it's wonderful to be with someone like that, you know?

SPEAKER_00 8:19

Absolutely. It's so good. And that is why the Lord put you guys together. It's awesome. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

What are quick question? What are some of the most common couples? Like, is there one Enneagram pair that is the most common?

SPEAKER_00 8:31

That is a great question. I don't think so. I would love to do that research and know, but that is why Beth McCormick, okay, she and her husband have created this awesome course series where you can purchase a workshop for your marriage and get it customized to you and your husband's type. So they've that's amazing. Isn't that incredible? And so I think that's coming out this summer sometime. And I'll be telling my friends all about it because what a great resource. Um, but no, I think there's, you know, especially I think we might be drawn to types similar to us, but that's where I think again, it depends your thinking. You know, birds of a feather fly together or opposites attract where you land probably is gonna really show up when you figure out your types and go, oh, yeah, I definitely chose someone who is fairly similar. Yes, or chose someone completely opposite of me.

SPEAKER_01 9:31

Totally. That makes so much sense. Yeah. And I think, yeah, it is so interesting. I think the more you obviously in marriage specifically, it's one of those things where the longer you're married, if you're intentional, the more you get to know each other. So I love that you're doing this and talking about just these personalities because it it really is a way to better understand each other and to know how to put almost like your personality into words. Cause even as I was just even refreshing on like, okay, Dave's personality and my personality and listening to some of your podcasts, it was like, oh, this is this is just a tool to help me better understand like why he thinks this way and why I want to, you know, say, why are we doing it this way? Let's do it this way, you know. And so it's just it's really helpful. And so I'm excited even to grow in my understanding of this because I do think it can be such a helpful tool for marriage.

SPEAKER_00 10:17

Absolutely. And I tell everyone, you know, you can hear about the enneagram and you can choose, uh, I already know about personality tests. I don't want anything to do with it. And I say that's fine, take it or leave it. But if you're looking for a shortcut to growth and, you know, a quicker, clearer, defined path to growth, I think the enneagram just spells it out really well. And it cuts for some of the confusion and the noise out there, and you can get something tailor-made for you and speaks your language and maybe even gives you words to better understand what it is, why you do what you do or why you feel the way you feel. And and then it maybe even helps. I know it has for me, where in my communication to my spouse, I know better what perspective he's coming from, and then I understand why I'm feeling the way I'm feeling. And I can use, you know, the words that I've learned through the Aneagram to help him understand my perspective too.

SPEAKER_01 11:13

It's yeah, exactly. I know, I know me and my husband, we were just having a conversation this morning. And the more I even look at like, oh, his type one personality and my type three, you know, even in the conversation, he was like entering into the moment right there, like, hey, can we talk about this? And I'm like, I gotta get out the door to go to work, and you know, can we plan ahead? Let's hear it, let's schedule this time and we can do it right here, you know. And he's like, Oh, so it's just even in that moment, seeing like, wow, we are not, neither one is right or wrong, but we're totally coming at this moment right here, you know, before we walk out the door with a completely different perspective. And even just before I started talking to you, I was like, wow, just looking at these Enneagram numbers. It honestly was very eye-opening just relating it directly to this morning, you know. Yes, so I find it so helpful.

SPEAKER_00 12:01

Yeah, it is so helpful. Yeah, so today we're gonna talk a lot about the messages our heart longs to hear as it pertains to marriage and as it pertains to sexual intimacy. So you gotta tell us this is your first time doing a book launch as a married woman. But it's so busy. And even though you have your sister and your dynamic duo, it requires a lot. How's it going? And tell us a little bit more about the new book.

SPEAKER_01 12:29

Yes. So the new book, Sex, Purity and the Longings of a Girl's Heart. It's very interesting because this is a book all on sex and purity and the longing struggles, you know, even addictions, and just really unpacking this topic that, especially within the church for women, isn't, you know, a common topic to hear about. You hear about it a lot for men, but it's something that we as women need. And that's one of the reasons we wrote it is just the amount of feedback and emails and you know, just messages saying help me that we get from women and knowing our own stories, that we are sexual beings that, you know, had struggles ourselves. So that's kind of why we wrote the book. But it's so interesting because I actually wrote this book before I got married. So I wrote this book with Kristen.

SPEAKER_00 13:14

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 13:15

Very interesting. And I know God's timing is perfect, and it was very clear that we were supposed to write this book when we did. And I think it is a book for actually for single or married women, um, because we really get to the to the heart of things and to the bigger picture and really, you know, understanding God's design for sexual intimacy and why he created us as sexual beings is something that I think single women need to understand just as much as married women, because if we don't understand our sexuality as a single woman, we can start to view it as a curse or why did God make me this way? You know, and it can almost become very painful if we don't understand why we're even made this way. So I think coming at this book from a perspective of not being married and have not having had sex yet, I think helped me to see it through the lens of a lot of women who might read it or might be struggling. And then of course, Kristen, she's been married for going on eight years. So she was able to really bring that perspective in, which was obviously very helpful. Absolutely. Right. Yeah, so it was, you know, I've done two book launches before with Girl Defined and Love Defined, but this one was very different because it's um one, not only is the topic, I would say, much more intense and even controversial in some senses, sure, um, and just more sensitive. Uh, but also I was married and trying to figure out, okay, how to balance the busyness of running a ministry, you know, girl defined, which you can relate to with your whole podcast and everything that you're doing. And when you kind of bear the bulk of the work, it's hard because you, it's like if this doesn't, if I don't do this, it's not getting done, you know? And so you totally you kind of have to figure out, okay, how much, you know, because the work can be unending. You can, I'm gonna do more, more, more, more, you know. So it was, it was a wonderful experience. And I think that um Kristen and I, my co-author, we're just so blessed to have wonderful husbands who see the value and the need for what we're doing and are there like a hundred and ten percent, and just loving us and encouraging us and jumping onto YouTube videos and helping us with posts, you know, giving the man perspective. Yeah, it's so good.

SPEAKER_00 15:18

So they've been wonderful. To see you guys together in those videos and just been seeing different posts there on your feeds. And um, they just seem like they've jumped right in and been open and you know, willing to be open and vulnerable in this process with you guys, which is that's huge. That's yeah, because your story and your testimony to purity and the struggle that I think is really inviting and opens the door to some great conversation.

SPEAKER_01 15:49

Oh, yeah. And it's something I think most women um really do want to talk about. And I think if you're married, you're looking back saying, okay, whatever your experience was growing up, whatever the perspective that you were taught about purity, it really can bring a lot into your marriage for the good or the bad. And I know so many women where they're still struggling with, you know, wrong perspectives that they were taught or just a lack of understanding of God's good design for intimacy within marriage. And it can be difficult. And so for me, in a lot of ways, I was really blessed to be able to write this book before I got married because it forced me to take like a deep dive into all of the topics of sex and sexuality and intimacy and being able to really like debunk any wrong mindsets I had had before going into marriage was like a huge gift. So I didn't really anticipate that in writing this book, but it was something that was you know more beneficial for me than I probably could have even anticipated. So that's been like an unexpected blessing, you know, bringing that into marriage.

SPEAKER_00 16:48

Yeah, absolutely. And ironic, again, like you said, God's timing was perfect. Uh and no mistake, how you were writing it as you, you know, before preparing for marriage, and um, and you know, way sooner than you thought. It's awesome. Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 17:04

Well, and it's you know, I think my husband and Kristen's husband's back, they're just getting used to us talking about all the things. So we just, you know, I'm like, you know, even in our we're part of a young marriage group, Dave and I, and I'm very comfortable talking about, you know, sex. And sometimes the other ladies around the table, like when we're in girls' groups, they're like, oh, and I'm like, sorry, I just wrote a book on this. I'm probably way too comfortable talking about this. I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_00 17:26

No, I don't think so at all. I think that's what we really want more of. We crave that. We crave those conversations so we can have a space to ask the questions that we're you know wondering about, or we don't feel like we can go anywhere else. And we don't want to go to the magazines or do exactly search. Uh we want we want honest, heartfelt advice from our girlfriends or you know, from mentors if they're willing to go there. Yeah. But again, that's not always a comfortable thing to do.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

Totally. Yeah, and a book is a great way to dig into those conversations.

SPEAKER_00 17:57

Now, I thought it would be really cool to try to connect the messages our heart longs to hear as the Enneagram communicates to us to this idea of addressing the brokenness that we've experienced sexually in our lives, or maybe, or maybe even the desires that we have. What do you think? Do you think we could go for it?

SPEAKER_01 18:19

This is such a core part of who we are that I think it is automatically connected, you know?

SPEAKER_00 18:24

It is. And I thought it was really fascinating because as soon as I I mean, I I knew what your book title was, but I hadn't really connected it till later on until I had already planned, oh, this is the direction I'd love to go with the conversation and address the message our heart wants to hear. And then like, oh, hey, that's part of the book title. Makes perfect sense. Totally. You know, and it is, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:47

And our, you know, our sexuality, and especially for the married women, you know, who are experiencing this, it's I think that knowing what we long to hear and feel and the message that our heart really wants. Um, I think that, you know, intimacy within marriage can be one of the best places to express that and to help satisfy each other in those ways and communicate and love each other in the best ways, or it can be like a major disconnect and intimacy can become one of those areas where it's like extremely distant or bitter or painful because you don't know how to best love each other. And really it's it's not in some ways, it's not that complicated if we took the time to study and research and l figure out how to love the person that we're married to, you know, our husbands, and say, okay, how is he longing? You know, what is that message that his heart is craving and how through intimacy, um, how can I strive in my very best to, you know, satisfy that? So it may, it may not be as complicated as we as we initially think, you know.

SPEAKER_00 19:49

Yeah, that's true. And especially when we can put it into language that we understand and resonate with us. I think that's a good piece to it. Okay, so for the enneagram type one, the message their heart longs to hear is you are good. Talk to me about that a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 20:06

Yeah, well, you know, my husband is a one, so I can really, really relate to that and understand, you know, from someone being married to a one, just seeing like, wow, so often when he is communicating something or even, you know, through sexual intimacy or talking about that, it's I can get distracted on all these other points and think like, oh, you know, this is this is good for us, or we need to do this. But so often he's saying a bunch of stuff that doesn't say isn't asking, like, am I good? Do you love me? You know, am I good enough for you? But when I dig deep down, that's ultimately just what he wants to know, you know. And I think especially for a man who is a one, um, I think so often, like uh a woman who is willing and excited to love him through sexual intimacy, I think so often can communicate that. Like you are good and I love you and I want you and I want to do this with you. And I've noticed that for my husband when I am excited and willing and not just like, okay, let's, you know, get this off the checklist or okay, here's, you know, it's less practical. It's really me like entering into his world and entering into that moment. It communicates to him in a way that I can't even fully understand because I'm not wired and created just like him, even down to his personality type. So I think for women who are a one or who are married to a one, understanding like, wow, you know, this is a way through intimacy and just in through the way you communicate, really entering into that moment and saying, like, you know, I love you for who you are, and God made you this way, and I'm gonna view that as a really good thing and not view your type of personality and who you are as kind of like a negative thing. I think it's really important to make that connection.

SPEAKER_00 21:51

Oh, that's good. Oh, that's awesome. I like that. Okay, a lot of stuff to think on for those who are married to one or who are one. I'm interrupting this Anneagram conversation to remind you about the Simply Summer workshop that is here to help you with the no-schedule long day, sibling fatting, boredom concert eating, and the messy house. You can have the summer you've always wanted with your kids. A Simply Summer is completely possible for you because it totally works. First, download the 50 screen-free boredombuster ideas, which are perfect for those with kids 12 and under. And then you can get my Simply Summer Quick Start Guide, which helps you guide each of your kids into the routine they need. And of course, the Simply Summer Workshop will take you step by step to create the schedule you desire, help foster sibling unity, eliminate boredom, and keep a cleaner home, all while giving you more time to get things done. It's possible, I promise. You can have your best summer this year. I put all the details in the show notes, as well as a special discount code just for you. Now back to our summer in the Enneagram. Okay, type two, you are wanted.

SPEAKER_01 23:09

That one, you know, it's it's makes me like, oh, you know, like the almost a little bit like, oh, you know, such a such a core just desire of wanting to feel like I just want to know that I'm wanted. And I love that ultimately in Christ, these things can be satisfied outside of our imperfections and outside of our, you know, wanting to be wanted or having a spouse that wants to be wanted. I think it's wonderful to know that ultimately we can rest in the fact that Christ. Christ has wanted them and given himself fully through the death, you know, his death on the cross. And so that that brings a lot of peace to my heart because it's, I think that's a big challenge to live up to is saying, like, oh, my spouse, I want them to know that I want to be wanted or they want to be wanted. What if I don't measure up? You know, so I think just to encourage the listener to rest in that. Um, but also kind of like I was saying with the one, um, if you are married to a two, I think that communicating verbally and even just through, you know, your body language or whatever, that you love and desire and want them and expressing words like I like you, not just I love you or I'm, you know, I'm married to you, but like I like you. I'm excited to be with you. Here are the things I like about you, you know, like you're my best friend. Like verbalizing those things, I think so helps communicate to them, like I really want you. I'm not just married to you and stuck with you, you know.

SPEAKER_00 24:32

Yeah, that's good. Yeah, and I'd love to point out too the you know, just reiterate again, all of these, the messages the heart longs to hear, they can only be fully satisfied in Christ. And that's why the Anneagram helps point us to the path of growth, growth to wholeheartedness in Christ. But this gives us the language and kind of like what we've talked about. So as a single person, yeah, to understand that our core desire is to be wanted, we're gonna naturally have that desire with the opposite sex to be wanted. And there's nothing wrong with that. The Lord just is totally I'm gonna satisfy in that. And then as we form relationships, we still make sure that we're getting that from Christ alone first. And then being wanted by someone else in marriage is just the cherry on top.

SPEAKER_01 25:26

Yeah, absolutely. Well, and to even add on to that, I think it's for singles, one of the things that was so helpful for me was being in good, solid community because that helped me to have those deep friendships and my heart longed to be just even to be known by my friends and to have that deep, deep, satisfying friendship. And so I think if marriage isn't something that's you know necessarily on the horizon, um, realizing that good, solid friendships with girlfriends can actually do wonders for your soul and really help satisfy that. And God created us for community.

SPEAKER_00 25:57

So yeah, that's awesome. Absolutely. Okay, well, we're talking about ourselves here. So, number type three, you are loved for simply being you.

SPEAKER_01 26:08

Oh dear, this one hits too close to home. I don't know. You know, it's it's silly because I it's so funny. Like, I will ask my husband all the time, like, do you like me? Do you love me? You know, and I'm just wanting to know like, do you like me for who I am? Do I need to change? Yeah. And I'm very bold, so I'll just ask him. You know, I'm not like waiting around, like, you know, try to read my mind. I'm a little bit more expressive. But it's, you know, it's we've we've had conversations about that because he's like, you know, I yes, I like you and I love you. And I'm like, I just like hearing it on a regular basis, how much you just love me for me, you like the way I am, you don't want anyone else. You know, I just like hearing that reaffirmed over and over again. Um, but I think there's something really, you know, cool about this feeling of you are love for simply being you, just getting back to the core of like, wow, God created me as an individual to be with this personality type, to view the world through this lens. And obviously, I'm gonna grow and become more like Christ through this, but just really settling in and realizing like I have worth because ultimately God created this me this way, and He loves me for the personality that He gave me and not necessarily looking to other things to give me that worth. That's been super, super helpful. And I've noticed I need that because even within marriage, and as a single, I would look to other people to get my identity and you know, to get to gain my worth. And even within marriage, I've you know, really looked to my husband, like like I was saying, do you love me? Do you like me? And wanting to ask him these things and realizing like I need to just rest in the fact that God created this way, this way. He knitted me together in my mother's room. I'm fearfully and wonderfully made. Um, and I don't have to stress all the time about trying to be loved, knowing, yes, my husband loves me, yes, God loves me. And the more I rest in that, I think the more I better express and live out who God created me to be.

SPEAKER_00 28:02

Absolutely. Amen. Preach it, sister. And may I point out this is not another arena that we need to, well, refine our performance. And you know, again, it goes back to we can maybe stress out. How well did we perform? How well did that go? And it's going back to being confident that we're loved simply for being who we are by Christ, and for in a healthy marriage, that's not what's being measured or being you know, taken in account. So, okay, so type four. You are seen and loved for exactly who you are.

SPEAKER_01 28:41

That's a really good one as well. And you know, all of these, there's nine of them, but and I I come from a family of eight kids, obviously, parents are now married. So I'm looking through all of them and I'm like, I feel like everyone, we've got like the full package as a family. Probably do between all of these, but you are seen and loved for exactly who you are. And so I think for the fours, um, you know, whether single or married, no matter where they are in life, I think sometimes it can it can be easy, even in a world of social media, um, to really play the comparison game and to really feel like there's something to measure up to or to compare to. And that's hard, especially for us as women, even in marriage, even as singles, like we are constantly comparing and saying, okay, am I, does anyone, you know, it's like we're we're so connected but not connected and no one really knows us. Um, and so I think that um, like we've constantly said, going back to Christ for that, but really I think developing solid friendships where people can speak into your life and really know you and really encourage you and love you for who God created you to be and really pull you along in that. I think the the place for this, you know, this message of the four that gets dangerous is when they're isolated or when they're just on social media. It can be so discouraging in feeling like, okay, I'm not seen, I'm not loved, no one really knows me, you know? Um, and so I think pulling back that barrier a little bit and developing those real good friendships in person and being willing to be open about who you actually are and sharing some of your thoughts and feelings, I think can help you to get this, you know, really the satisfaction of this message you long to hear of wanting to be seen and wanting to be loved. It's something you might have to be a little bit more vulnerable with.

SPEAKER_00 30:29

Yeah. Yeah. And envy and jealousy are a struggle for the four. So I think pointing out, like you did, you know, be careful what we're the input that we're getting and the comparison that's gonna otherwise gonna cause you to go into that downward spiral that we don't want to get in.

SPEAKER_01 30:49

Oh, and that's a never-ending battle. I mean, it's I feel it's harder than ever, you know, especially with the rise of social media and even media and movies. It's just a battle we have to be aware of, or else I think it's exactly that. It'll be a downward spiral, which won't take us anywhere good.

SPEAKER_00 31:04

Yeah, absolutely. Okay, type five. Your needs are not a problem. And I love this list. So all your listeners will they be able to get this? Oh, yeah, they will. We'll post on social media, they'll be able to download it because, right? We need that right in front of us, I think, most days, especially as we interact with those that we love.

SPEAKER_01 31:23

Exactly. I know it's so helpful. Um, I'm thinking of one person in particular where it's, you know, this your needs are not a problem. I feel like they are um, you know, want to help other people and be others focused. And it's sometimes so hard I almost have to drag it out of them. Like, okay, what do you actually want? And how, yes, how can I love you? How can I help you? And sometimes I'm like, I honestly I feel like, are they telling me or are they just trying to tell me what they think? You know, I want to hear and I, you know, I have no problem telling people what I want. Like, here's what I need, you know, but realizing like that's not easy for everyone. And so I think, you know, particularly with this five, your needs are not a problem for, you know, kind of big personalities like us. I think it's important to really slow down and kind of take off the speed a little bit. Yeah, and really just and you know, say, okay, like it's not like, hey, tell me what you need. I'm in a hurry, I'm snapping my fingers, I gotta go, but slowing down and saying, okay, really, I really care. I really want to know. You can help me love you by sharing this with me, you know, like so you can love me best by telling me what you need and knowing that I don't view this as a burden. I don't view this as a problem, you know, and even communicating those words, I think can be helpful just because it's it's a little bit scary and a little bit like, I don't want to be a problem, I don't want to mess anything up, I don't want to be a burden. And just really letting them know you're not a burden to me, I think is important.

SPEAKER_00 32:51

So spot on. This is good, man. All right. Type six, you are safe.

SPEAKER_01 32:59

This one again, it's like, oh, you know, kind of wanna makes me want to hug. I know, go on, go ahead. Hug the sixes. You're six. Yes, we're the sixes. Yeah. Again, I'm thinking of someone specifically um with this six personality. And um, I think that when I think of them and I think about their desire to want to be safe, um, sometimes that kind of being expressed in different ways. Sometimes it can almost look like, oh, they don't really care, or they're they're kind of like uh kind of by themselves sometimes, or they don't really let me in. And I think a lot of it is because of the fear um at the root of it, of just fearful of, okay, am I safe to share this? Am I safe to let people in? Especially if you've been yeah, if you've been hurt by someone or your trust has been betrayed by someone, um, this particular message that the six songs to hear that they are safe, it can be hard to even know how to let people in, you know. And so I think being calm and sensitive and knowing it may not be like a one-day thing. It may be a process of really building that trust and really letting them know, like, hey, you can trust me. I'm not gonna gossip behind your back or use this against you, pull up the history of what you've done, you know, but just I'm here to love you, I care about you, and this is kind of I'm willing to go down the long road of this with you. I don't need this instant fix, you know. So I think just being patient in the way that we love sixes is really important.

SPEAKER_00 34:27

Yeah, sixes are some of the most loyal people out there, and what a gift to have in friendship, right? And so they are waiting for that to be demonstrated back to them. So what a gift we can give if we're willing to show our steady faithfulness, our true blue friendship or marriage relationship and our willingness to, you know, just be steady in the intimacy process as well. That's yeah. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 34:55

Yeah, and it's it's hard, it can be so hard because we don't, it's so hard to view life through a different lens, you know.

SPEAKER_00 35:01

It's so hard to get caught up understanding.

SPEAKER_01 35:05

Like, how can you think this way or how do you feel this way? Like, I don't even relate, but realizing like God did create a variety of people and a variety of personality types, and the the time we take to enter into like learning about them, yeah, it just helps us to better love people. And so if for everyone listening right now, it's like okay, downloading this PDF, really striving to say, okay, how can I better love the sixes? You know, that they just want to be safe. How can I be patient? How can I be, you know, enduring in this friendship and show them I really care? I think that's so important. And it takes intentionality, it's not just gonna happen by accident. Right.

SPEAKER_00 35:41

Yeah, absolutely. All right, type seven, you will be taken care of.

SPEAKER_01 35:48

This is another, they're all just so like some some they have some similarities, but you know, very different at the core of it. Um, I think that the you will be taken care of. It it really brings to mind like um intentionality on the part of the other. So whether you're married to someone with this or you are, you know, single and you have friends with this, I think it's a you will be taken care of really means that the person is kind of like pursuing your heart and showing you, demonstrating through their words and through their actions, like visibly almost, that I am gonna take care of your heart. I'm gonna take care of the information you're sharing with me. I am pursuing you. Um, I really feel like it's it's it's not just necessarily like just sitting there and you know putting your arm around them, but really showing them through your actions. Like I'm willing to do what it takes to love you in this way and to take care of you and to really brings back to the heart, like, okay, the things I feel like the heart can be such a vulnerable and is such a vulnerable place.

SPEAKER_02 36:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:50

And so I think that what they're sharing with you or the them letting you into their heart, it's so important to know like I value this and I am not going to take this for granted. I'm going to listen intently and give you my attention and show you that I really care about what you're sharing with me, and I really care about you, and I really care about the fact that you're being vulnerable and letting me in. Again, it's kind of that slowing down and really expressing that and communicating that through our actions.

SPEAKER_00 37:20

Yeah, sevens can exude so much energy. It could be, it could be pretty easy to gloss over the fact that the cry of their heart is to be taken care of. And I think it's also interesting because those who are a seven and a woman, I think, you know, the desire for marriage is gonna be so natural because it's gonna feel like, oh, a man will take care of me. And and that's where as you're in the waiting room and the waiting room of God, and maybe for that season, to realize that He is ultimately gonna be the only perfect one to take care of you, and again, a going that um you will be taken care of whether you have the man in your life or not, uh, is gonna be so huge. And then even if you are married and you're feeling like you're not being taken care of, God is trustworthy and He will make sure that you're taken care of. And you know, and it kind of you know it flows into some of these again, then your needs are not a problem, and and all of these, and it's so fascinating to me when you study the lines of growth and stress, which we won't even touch here, but how they start connecting um with those messages our heart longs to hear, and as one thing kind of leads to another, but if we get it satisfied, yeah, exactly. The core message satisfied, it can lead us to such growth.

SPEAKER_01 38:45

Um yeah, I can't and thinking of, you know, kind of building on what you were saying, it's like I do think that for some personalities over the other, things like um, you know, desire for a satisfying relationship, you know, like if you're single, wanting that, or if you're married and maybe it's a struggling marriage, it can be, I truly believe for some personality types, like a seven, it can be harder um just because of the way that God has made them and wired them. Like I know for me when I was single and not really sure if I was gonna get married, I was I wanted that, but God really, you know, just gave me grace and strength and just with my personality to kind of go forward and say, okay, here's where he has me. I'm gonna do and go and you know, try to build his kingdom. And there are other girls around me who are even younger than me, and it is a much bigger struggle because they just desire that, you know. So I think being sensitive to that and knowing like it's not all equal in the sense of like everyone's not processing the same way as me. So having grace and realizing like this may be harder just because of their personality, and that's okay, and I can be patient with that and love them through that.

SPEAKER_00 39:49

That's a great point. I think that is really important. Okay, type eight. This one's this one's pretty deep. You will not be betrayed. Ooh, man, talk about a lot of sexual, a lot of potential for sexual brokenness, right?

SPEAKER_01 40:07

Yeah. Well, and you know, my um Kristen who called the book co-authored the book with me, she is an eight. Oh, no kidding. And so oh, you guys are a dynamic duo. I know. So we're like a little bit like two lionesses, like sometimes you just chill out a little. Yes. But I I see this and I'm like, oh yeah, you know, Kristen, she's that self-confident, willful, you know, she can be so confrontational and in all the in good ways, you know, it's like it cracks me up. But the you will not be portrayed, you know, it was interesting as her and I were writing the book, Sex Creating the Longings of a Girl's Heart. You know, I wasn't married, so she was really having to give her perspective on um, you know, intimacy within marriage from someone who had been married for about eight years. And I couldn't obviously give that perspective, I could give my own perspective. But one of the things that was um, you know, she kept emphasizing was, you know, especially with her personality type, I think that in some ways the you will not be betrayed can so come down to like the emotional standpoint as well for a woman. Um, and even feeling like, okay, within intimacy, not being betrayed even emotionally because of my emotions and my sexuality, they're such a big, strong personality. And I think that's what gives them that drive and that confidence is they have like, they are like passionate and emotional, and here we go. And they can be confrontational and just kind of give their all. But in the same way, it can almost um be more painful if they feel like, okay, you are not, you know, or do you really love me through this or I'm dealing with something, but you want intimacy, like I'm not there right now. And so she was kind of expressing that through her lens. And I thought, wow, that's so interesting and I think so important to realize it may just not be like, you know, betrayal of like something physical that has happened, but it really can be even so emotional, especially for women with this type. So um, really being aware of that. And I think if you are an eight, realizing like that may be a strong tendency to connect those two so much that it almost feels like, how could he be thinking this? Or why would he want this right now when I'm, you know, here I feel like he's almost betraying me, but it's it can be so often the emotions that are so strong in that. So recognizing, like, okay, how can I, you know, kind of deal with my emotions and the reality of the situation that's going on? Because I don't don't want to exasperate something that may not be as big, but then also, you know, learning to express to your spouse, like, hey, this is how I am seeing this, and this is how it makes me feel when you ask for this, but I'm struggling emotionally. So that's one of the big things that comes to mind just because of you know, my relationship with Kristen and kind of her expressions of this.

SPEAKER_00 42:55

As spot on, I I would say that the eights are maybe not the most tender, but the most surprisingly tender and sensitive. It's true. That they present this tough exterior, but really on the inside, they're just soft little teddy bears who want to be loved and not be betrayed. It's so true.

SPEAKER_01 43:17

I see that with Kristen so much. I'm like, she is a go-getter, and like you, you know, you might be intimidated sometimes by her in the way she can just boldly communicate, but she's extremely like sensitive and um has a whole nother side to her. And so I think it's recognizing that like may not always be on the inside what comes across on the outside. Like, there's for sure another side to them.

SPEAKER_00 43:39

Absolutely, yeah, such a good point. Okay, we are finishing here with type nine. Your presence matters.

SPEAKER_01 43:51

And you know, thinking of my husband, he's a type one, so his wings are like a two or a nine. Yep. And one of my siblings is also a nine. And when I think of them, I think of like how much they want to always be connected and um be kind of together, and they want that reassurance of knowing, like, hey, you're in this with me together. Right, I matter, right? And so I think of, yeah, I matter, you you know, you care about me, and they're they're always wanting that. And so I think that the your presence matters. Um, you know, you you hear these stories of different couples, and some of them it's like, okay, they can kind of go their two different directions and come back together at the end of the day, and they're like, okay, great, we just had a, you know, they're more practical and then they can just kind of deal with it. But I think for some realizing like, okay, it's important for me to physically be present, emotionally be present, and realizing that for a nine, that that's really important in a way that someone more practical, someone more black and white, someone who feels like, oh, you know, we've we we spent an evening together once this these two weeks. I'm feeling great for a nine that may not look the same way, you know. Right. And I mean, you wait, you're married to a nine. I am, I am so you probably have great insight into this.

SPEAKER_00 45:13

Yeah, and I think ultimately it's communicating that I can't and I don't want to do this without you, especially for come you know, combining our personality types. I want, you know, I'm just um I uh the take charge and independent and you know, whatever. And so me pausing and taking time to simply be and find my high side. But then and then acknowledging the needs and his presence and how much I do ultimately when I dial in. I don't want to do this alone. I I I don't want to do life without you. It's really important that not only that you do things with me, but that you're a part of the decision making and you're part of my world on a regular basis, not just when it's convenient for me. So that's that's so good.

SPEAKER_01 46:03

And as a three, I can relate to all of that. And you know, I I see a lot of the nine in my husband as well, even though he's mainly a one, but I see a lot of that and exactly what you're saying. It's like I can be like on the go and I've got it. And instead slowing down and really inviting him in and showing him like I need you, not just when I'm struggling, but you're my teammate through all of this, and I want you a part of this. Let's let's slow down and communicate about this and make sure we're really a team in this. Like it's not just me and you and I need your help. It's like we are a team, and I think communicating that and expressing that team mindset um is super, at least for our marriage, it's that's super important.

SPEAKER_00 46:45

Yeah, it's huge. It really you'll see a ton of growth if you are married to one, or you can understand that about yourself if you're a nine. Um yeah, my husband's a uh nine wing one, and if your husband's a one wing nine, then yeah, there are a lot of similarities, so for sure. And we love them, they're awesome and they're exactly what we need.

SPEAKER_01 47:04

I know. We married them, and God knew he's like, okay, those threes. Yeah, they're gonna need that.

SPEAKER_00 47:10

We need a simmer day on hot sauce. So we like to say okay. Well, I think we have given man so much amazing content, but I would love to just leave us with one little tidbit about your book specifically. You would give a lot of insight because you are sharing a lot of what you guys have written about and what you've shared about in this. And I I think, like you said, married or not, um, single or not, this book is for you. If you are a woman, you will want to pick this up. What would you say the next step, if you could sum it up into one step? I know it's gonna be hard, but could our friends take towards sexual freedom in their lives?

SPEAKER_01 47:52

I would say the next step would be, and this is gonna be a hard step, um, but really just slowing down and getting honest about your own journey and then being willing to find a godly woman who you can say, hey, I want to open up and talk about my own journey and ask questions and share things that I've struggled with and haven't been able to, you know, talk about before. I think that can be one of the most freeing things. It can kind of take away the fear and the kind of the scariness of this entire topic is finding a woman you can trust. Yeah, all of the shame and even wrong mindsets you've been taught about purity or about, you know, sex. Um, finding someone you really admire and trust and saying, hey, even maybe bringing the book and saying, hey, this book came out, it's been, you know, bringing up some questions. I'd love to have a godly woman to talk about it with. I think that could be one of the best next steps that women could take.

SPEAKER_00 48:46

That's huge. I I can't tell you how many times and you know, specifically about sexual struggles or um, yeah, or just wanting freedom in that area. As soon as I let I stepped out of the darkness and took off that the the veil of shame and told a good friend or a mentor, yeah, and you know, just set it, put it out there in the open. Oh man, you know, so much freedom in just that step. It was not easy. Like you said, it's gonna be a really hard step. But once you take it, I you know, it just puts you, sets you on a path to freedom that is way much better than living in that dark tunnel of shame.

SPEAKER_01 49:26

Yeah, and that's the way that God designed it. You know, freedom is found in the light, but the enemy wants us to stay in the darkness and he wants us to believe, like, okay, we can do it on our own, or you know, no one, all the lies, like, you know, people will think you're just awful and weird, or no one else struggles with this. But I think the more we've seen ourselves and you know, all of the women that we've talked to throughout this journey, the more that they've brought it into the light and have been willing to be honest, you realize I'm not the only one. This isn't just a man problem, or I'm not the only woman that struggles with this. Like this, there's nothing new under the sun. There are other women struggling and they don't want to stay there either. And they're they've been brave, they've been bold, and I know that God can give me the strength to do, you know, to do the same.

SPEAKER_00 50:07

Amen. Bethany, this was so good. I like awesome. I just can't get over how great this conversation was. I had like this is awesome. The people they're gonna be minister minister to, and through your book and through your boldness, and your sister and your husbands and your brother-in-law. Just so cool. It makes me want to sit down with your parents and learn from them and meet your family and just like you know, you're so sweet conversation.

SPEAKER_01 50:37

Yes, I know. Well, they they had a lot of experience at eight kids, so they're yeah, they're wonderful and awesome, and we've learned a lot from them for sure.

SPEAKER_00 50:46

Are you are you gals gonna do any conferences this year or anything?

SPEAKER_01 50:50

We are so we have we're in the you know, book launch happened and now it's like full speed ahead with conference. Our I guess it's our fourth annual conference that Pearl Defined Ministries is hosting here in San Antonio on August 2nd and 3rd. So the theme of this year's conference is chasing truth, being a girl who fearlessly pursues God's word. Um, so we're just really excited to have breakouts, digging into you know, everything related to chasing truth in the different areas of our lives from love to eating disorders to anxiety, um, everything like that. And then obviously the main sessions really just learning in this generation, especially. It is so hard to chase truth, and you the pushback is strong. So we're excited about August the second and third and would love to have anyone join us.

SPEAKER_00 51:33

Oh, yeah, that's gonna be good. Awesome content.

unknown 51:35

That's so great.

SPEAKER_00 51:38

So, what do you think? Do you have a better understanding of an Enneagram type three? I certainly hope you learned a little bit more in our conversation today. Now, you've taken the first step in the Enneagram journey and tuned in to hear perspective. But if you're looking for more help, I have several ways to guide you. You can check out our Instagram feed for weekly Enneagram postings, and this week I've highlighted the message we long to hear. Each one that I talked about with Bethany today. Or you can get the wholehearted Enneagram Quick Start. It's a step-by-step guide to gain clearer understanding on your dominant type. And now, if you're looking for a colorful overview, my wholehearted Enneagram summary gives you the highlights of all nine types on one page. It is so helpful as you talk to others about this awesome resource. And last but not least, I've just opened up a few more coaching spots for the summer and fall. Whether you need more help discerning your dominant type or one to clarify your unique path of growth. It's easy to get on the wait list for a free 30-minute consult. All the infos in the show notes are at simply wholehearted.com. Also, be sure to follow Girl Define on Instagram and get their newest book, Sex, Purity, and the Longings of a Girl's Heart. They've filled this one with tons of relatable stories to help encourage and give you practical application, which you can put into place right away. Remember, I want you to invite others to join us as we continue our summer in the Aneagram. Next week, we are talking about Aneagram 4s with another favorite guest, Shelly Miller. Our topic, of course, was about rest, and not just for type 4s. But like we did today and last week, we cover all nine types. And make sure you're subscribed so you don't miss another two-episode week. You never know when I might share an extra conversation. Don't forget to check us on Instagram and Facebook. We're posting giveaways, fun Enneagram tips, and so much more each week. Let's continue to invite others to join us as we continue to pursue perspective, purpose, and plans for a simply wholehearted life.